Psi. Official chat for the Psi Jabber client (http://psi-im.org)

Saturday, 24 June 2006< ^ >

Kev has set the subject to: Psi: Kicks for Communication (http://psi-im.org) | Room language: English | We often sleep, so if you don't get an answer immediately, hang around :) | Room logs now available at http://chatlogs.jabber.ru/psi@conference.jabber.ru/

Room Configuration

GMT+4
[00:03:34] <Kev> iono: make Alok a dukebox
[00:03:38] iono waves his <notopic>magic wand</notopic>
[00:03:40] <iono> *PING* ... Alok is a dukebox
[00:03:43] <iono> I AM THE WIZARD^^$Â£~Â£~~#*^@#%^#
[00:03:46] Kev hugs iono
[00:03:48] <ALok@work> i don;t get it...
[00:03:51] <iono> *squeaky*
[00:04:19] <ALok@work> i am kinda..... confused
[00:07:18] ALok@work pokes Kev
[00:07:30] Kev attacks alok with a stick
[00:07:33] <ALok@work> :(
[00:07:34] <iono> Kev attacks alok with 'stick' for 1477 damage.
[00:07:44] <ALok@work> :(
[00:07:48] <ALok@work> i don't get it
[00:07:58] ALok@work pokes Kev with iono
[00:08:03] iono pokes ALok@work
[00:15:03] <Kev> dukebox = play on words of jukebox
[00:15:14] <Kev> I asked iono to 'make alok a dukebox'
[00:15:21] <Kev> so he turned you into a dukebox
[00:15:24] <Kev> all explained :)
[00:15:33] <LRN> while (LRN.GetItemCount("SuperStimPack")) LRN.UseItem("SuperStimPack",Kev);
[00:26:52] <ALok@work> note very OOP
[00:26:56] <ALok@work> not*
[00:27:49] <ALok@work> ALok.Steal(LRN,"SuperStimPack").apply(ALok);
[00:28:29] <ALok@work> well bbl
[00:28:39] <ALok@work> its about time to go home
[00:29:43] <LRN> LOL, ALok :)
[00:29:53] <LRN> Do you know what you just did?
[00:30:21] <ALok@work> Nullpointer?
[00:30:43] <LRN> 1) I don't have any SuperStimPacks anymore (used all of them on Kev), so yes - nullpointer
[00:30:58] <ALok@work> :)
[00:31:21] <LRN> 2) You may die in every minute, if ALok.Healt < 15
[00:31:28] <LRN> Health
[00:31:58] <ALok@work> well later..
[00:32:03] ALok@work leaves the room
[00:32:19] <LRN> And he did :)
[00:52:58] <iono> ~oof~
[00:59:56] <ALok@lappy> I'm not quite dead yet
[01:00:01] <ALok@lappy> but still... bbl
[01:00:07] <ALok@lappy> need to do someother stuff
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[02:15:20] <albert> ==9613== LEAK SUMMARY:
==9613== definitely lost: 10,776 bytes in 59 blocks.
==9613== indirectly lost: 341,103 bytes in 9,934 blocks.
==9613== possibly lost: 4,009 bytes in 79 blocks.
==9613== still reachable: 554,893 bytes in 4,950 blocks.
==9613== suppressed: 0 bytes in 0 blocks.
[02:15:58] <psidekick> 23 Jun 21:40 - Fixed uninitialized value. - Fixed uninitialized value. - http://dev.psi-im.org/darcs/web/darcsweb.cgi?r=psi;a=commit;h=20060623214011-04f00-c00f0ee9554f2e9ddfa136b11a566b2859953cc6.gz
[02:26:13] <albert> Alot of memleaks in Qt...
[02:26:37] Maarten leaves the room
[02:27:55] <remko> albert: well, 350k, that could have been worse
[02:28:05] <remko> albert: it'll get fixed over time
[02:31:28] <albert> From a 2 minute run that's quite bad.
[02:32:50] <iono> I feel like I'm about to vomit everywhere.
[02:34:03] <remko> albert: yeah, then it's probably bad
[02:34:03] <remko> albert: well, it all depends if it's constant or it increases with run time
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[02:46:25] <psidekick> 23 Jun 21:36 - Static QCA compilation infrastructure. - Static QCA compilation infrastructure. - http://dev.psi-im.org/darcs/web/darcsweb.cgi?r=psi;a=commit;h=20060623213636-04f00-d870cc6ed1aaa3960fc30ed7eaef95ccaf4786c2.gz
[02:51:26] <albert> Hmm.
[02:52:43] <albert> What is the goal of static QCA?
[02:55:10] <Kev> anyone that fiddles with it will get a shock :)
[02:55:42] <Kev> actually, he was trying to avoid any more qca version/debug/release troubles
[02:56:52] <albert> iono: give kev a shock.
[02:57:00] iono gives kev a shock.
[02:57:13] Kev shocks iono back with a cattleprod
[02:57:17] iono shocks Kev
[02:58:06] <ALok> time to figure out how to compile qt
[02:58:20] <albert> "make" usually
[02:58:23] <ALok> win win32
[02:58:34] <Kev> "make" :)
[02:58:54] <Kev> although I have a clean build up today, so I don't know if you still want to bother
[02:59:07] <Kev> http://kismith.co.uk/files/psi/windows
[02:59:17] <ALok> ...
[02:59:24] <ALok> whatever
[02:59:32] <albert> That's not Qt though.
[02:59:41] remko leaves the room
[02:59:46] <Kev> I'm guessing he wants Qt to build Psi
[02:59:48] <Kev> I could be wrong
[02:59:55] <ALok> well yea...
[02:59:59] <ALok> but i like my own builds
[03:00:07] <Kev> but equally, if he just wanted to compile Psi, he probably wouldn't compile his own Qt
[03:00:09] <Kev> *shrug
[03:00:30] <albert> ALok: So you don't want to use the windows installer for Qt?
[03:00:48] <ALok> i wanna see if there is any difference...
[03:14:00] <Kev> it won't if you don't change the configure options
[03:14:14] <ALok> o well...
[03:14:35] <Kev> but you can add gif support for one thing
[03:14:55] <ALok> well who uses gif?
[03:15:05] <ALok> png is way better than gif
[03:15:10] <VxJasonxV> future APNG/MNG users
[03:15:16] <Kev> some of the jisps lying around the placo are gif-based
[03:15:34] <ALok> who started the whole jisp thing?
[03:15:36] <Kev> but yes, I shipped two betas and countless builds without noticing any lack of gif support
[03:15:51] <Kev> not sure, have a look at the jep?
[03:16:05] <ALok> there is a jep for jisp?
[03:16:31] <ALok> really need to put a jep for a jabber based hamachi
[03:17:30] <Kev> hamachi is interesting
[03:17:32] <ALok> how long do you think i should expect qt to take to build?
[03:17:41] <Kev> depends on the speed of your system
[03:17:45] <ALok> hamachi is nice... but there is userlimit
[03:18:08] <ALok> since jabber is open, it would be nice
[03:18:09] <Kev> was about 8 hours for a release+debug, ppc+x86 build on my mac mini
[03:18:34] <ALok> i feel like the darcs rss bot does not work :(
[03:18:49] <Kev> 'the darcs rss bot'?
[03:18:58] <ALok> i dunno
[03:19:08] <ALok> psi-darcs-mainline@rss.jabber.ru
[03:19:30] <ALok> it didn;t send me a message about the last commit
[03:22:13] <ALok> so 4.1.4 does fix the cpu usage bug?
[03:25:53] <Kev> I can't promise
[03:26:01] <Kev> but I've not seen it, on mac or windows, using 414
[03:29:43] <albert> The source file is updated to remove the condition mblsha mentioned in the quick fix.
[03:29:52] <albert> So I would say it is fixed.
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[03:31:58] <ALok> if there a diff between groupchat and MUC?
[03:32:38] <Kev> is there?
[03:32:39] <Kev> yes
[03:32:46] <ALok> where is groupchat defeined?
[03:33:05] <Kev> It isn't really, thus the problem
[03:33:08] <Kev> muuc replaces it
[03:33:11] <Kev> *muc
[03:33:24] <Kev> and since Psi now supports muc, there's not much need to worry about it :)
[03:33:30] <Kev> there might be a jep, I forget
[03:33:48] <ALok> do you know if pandion does MUC ?
[03:35:14] <Kev> I suspect so, I think everyone except Psi didi
[03:35:20] <Kev> *did
[03:39:31] <ALok> i belive pandion does not have full muc suppot
[03:39:41] <ALok> i dunno
[03:39:49] <ALok> someone was talking about it at qunu
[03:48:13] <ALok> i wish make had a progress status...
[03:50:08] <ALok> like if it printed the number of files compiled and the number left... after each file
[03:50:39] <ALok> but i guess the nested make don't help
[03:52:13] <Kev> well, nightly mac builds are nearly back :)
[04:14:25] <ALok> Qt build is slow!
[04:14:26] <ALok> yay
[04:17:23] <Kev> yeah, I warned you :)
[04:17:34] <Kev> espectially if you enabled both release and debug :)
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[04:25:13] <albert> I first did it in release only. That took 1 hour and 5 minutes.
[04:25:22] <albert> Then I did both. 20 minutes.
[04:25:38] <ALok> :(
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[04:25:48] <Kev> 20 minutes /extra/ that is, I suspect
[04:26:39] <deucalion> .oO( real {men|geeks|idiots} build kde svn from trunk with qt-copy ). - its fun! and takes ages... :-|
[04:27:00] <ALok> i'm gonna give up...
[04:27:03] <ALok> very soon
[04:27:12] <ALok> like now
[04:27:19] <ALok> sigint time
[04:27:31] <Kev> right
[04:27:39] <Kev> I think that nightlies are now set up
[04:27:40] <albert> No, 20 minutes.
[04:28:00] <Kev> albert: did you do a make distclean?
[04:28:04] <albert> I think ccache is to thank. I had 4.1.3 installed previously.
[04:28:09] <deucalion> albert: qt-copy full clean build takes 20 minutes for you?
[04:28:19] <deucalion> ccache...? thats cheating ;)
[04:28:24] <Kev> so infact
[04:28:25] <albert> I removed the old tree, so yes. I guess distclean.
[04:28:27] <deucalion> (if it was distcc at least...)
[04:28:28] <Kev> exactly as I said
[04:28:35] <Kev> 20 mins extra
[04:28:42] <Kev> unless you wiped the ccache
[04:28:52] <deucalion> mmh..
[04:28:53] <albert> Ofcourse not.
[04:29:16] <albert> It hasn't trashed anything for me so far.
[04:29:38] <ALok> with a new qt do i need to rebuild qca
[04:29:45] <ALok> ?
[04:29:46] <Kev> ALok: yes
[04:29:51] <ALok> o fun
[04:29:52] <ALok> yay
[04:29:57] <Kev> but
[04:30:05] <Kev> notice the recent build notes
[04:30:11] <ALok> what where?
[04:30:37] <albert> It is really hard to fix Psi if you do it the wrong way. Like if you install Qt, then build Psi and then upgrade Qt (removing old version).
[04:30:50] <albert> Then you won't be able to do make clean and such things.
[04:31:08] <Kev> albert: you can if you qmake
[04:31:26] <Kev> since it regenerates the makefiles to make clean from
[04:31:38] <albert> Why add so many commands? Configure, qmake, make?
[04:32:21] <Kev> it's actually the same as on a auto* build system
[04:32:34] <Kev> autoconf/qconf to make the configure script
[04:32:45] <Kev> ./configure to do settings
[04:32:56] <Kev> qmake/automake to generate the makefiles
[04:33:02] <Kev> make to build
[04:33:17] <albert> It is just that autotool are less magical.
[04:33:22] <Kev> indeed
[04:33:32] <Kev> bloody hopeless would be a better description than magic :)
[04:33:46] <albert> Did KDE decide to use qconf?
[04:33:48] <Kev> anyway, unless you go doing silly things, you only ever need ./configure&&make
[04:33:52] <Kev> I doubt it
[04:34:06] <Kev> I'd be shocked if they're not autotools
[04:34:38] <albert> The goal page said they should evaluate cmake.
[04:34:43] <albert> And a few others.
[04:35:49] <albert> Speaking of that...
[04:36:08] <albert> Justin didn't answer wether there would be a new qca beta release this month.
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[05:53:35] <ALok> yay for 4.1.4
[05:53:56] <ALok> i haven't been able to repeat the 100% cpu usage
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[05:55:10] <ALok> creating toolbars crashes...
[05:55:11] <ALok> o well
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[09:53:50] <iono> KAZAM.
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[11:35:17] <hawke> Hey IceRAM
[11:51:45] <IceRAM> morning hawke
[11:52:10] <hawke> How goes it?
[11:52:19] <IceRAM> well... one more exam left
[11:52:28] <IceRAM> I'm currently cleaning up around here
[11:52:44] <IceRAM> packing everything from the other exams
[11:53:02] <IceRAM> preparing for the holiday after all :)
[11:53:33] <hawke> hehe
[11:53:40] <hawke> cool
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[12:43:50] <iono> pikachu!
[12:44:10] <Skaarj> iono: where?
[12:44:16] <iono> under a book. my precious
[12:44:59] <Skaarj> heh
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[13:49:54] <Kev> meh
[13:49:59] <Kev> there would be a new nightly psi build
[13:50:13] <Kev> but the default osx install is for the machine to sleep
[13:50:21] <Kev> so when I went to bed, so did the machine
[13:50:32] <Kev> anyway, it won't sleep anymore, so it should be ok :)
[13:50:41] Kev generates a nightly by hand
[13:53:18] <albert> Thanks, R.H.
[13:53:23] <albert> Even though I don't have a mac.
[13:54:12] <Kev> indeed
[14:01:09] <deucalion> qt-copy takes now longer than 12h... this is insane
[14:01:17] <deucalion> ...
[14:01:28] deucalion wants a new cpu/notebook :|
[14:03:17] <Kev> deucalion: are you compiling both debug and release?
[14:05:11] <TobiasFar> will the next psi release include user tune?
[14:05:28] <Kev> depends a great deal on servers
[14:06:01] <Kev> if servers are out there supporting PEP when we launch, yes probably
[14:06:03] <TobiasFar> why? because PubSub components are needed?
[14:06:07] <Kev> if not..who knows
[14:06:15] <Kev> no, pep's needed rather than pubsub
[14:06:28] <albert> An version 1.8, that is.
[14:06:37] <Kev> and since pep doesn't exist in any servers yet
[14:07:22] <TobiasFar> but pep is based on pubsub, right?
[14:07:45] <Kev> right
[14:07:53] <TobiasFar> okay
[14:09:01] <Kev> the biggest difference is probably that it won't work from an external component though
[14:09:02] <deucalion> Kev: I have honestly no idea what kdesvn-builder compiles in detail... ( http://www.kde-apps.org/content/show.php?content=23840 ). I guess its debug, but maybe my 2ghz p4m throttled at 75% (to avoid overheat) is too slow.. - it only took a few hours last time when it (cpu+compiling) ran at 100%... but I had to change the motherboard one time already and I don't want to do that again :P
[14:09:05] <Kev> the server has to support it
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[14:09:59] <deucalion> I rally hope wildfire will be first with 1.8 support ;)
[14:10:04] <deucalion> really*
[14:10:13] <Kev> looks like it will to me
[14:10:21] deucalion nods
[14:13:03] <remko> deucalion: it will be
[14:13:19] <remko> deucalion: and PEP will pbb be in WF 3.0.1
[14:13:33] <albert> The question is, will wildfire support SRV for all platforms soon? ;)
[14:13:47] <zenek42> And what about ejabberd?
[14:13:57] <remko> albert: it doesn't support SRV ?
[14:14:09] <remko> zenek42: unclear.
[14:14:18] <remko> zenek42: they're also 'working on it'
[14:14:25] <zenek42> hmmhm.
[14:14:28] <zenek42> thanks
[14:14:58] <albert> Wasn't there someone here who had a problem with it and found a post on their forums that described that others had the same problem related to their resolving code?
[14:15:10] <remko> albert: i'm no expert ;)
[14:16:48] <albert> It was R.H.
[14:17:16] <albert> http://chatlogs.jabber.ru/psi@conference.jabber.ru/2006/06/22.html#15:46:59
[14:18:35] <remko> albert: ah right, i recall that problem.
[14:18:42] <remko> haven't read the details
[14:18:47] <remko> SRV works fine for me
[14:19:46] <albert> Gato says it has been fixed in wildfire and smack.
[14:22:59] <albert> zenek42: do they know in ejabberd@conference.jabber.ru?
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[14:23:46] <remko> zenek42: first of all, they need PubSub 1.8, and then legoscia needs to rewrite his patch (at least that's what h intended to do ;))
[14:23:59] <remko> zenek42: mickael was not uninterested in writing PEP support himself
[14:35:42] <zenek42> hm, thanks
[14:59:58] <iono> Oops, I've ruined it.
[15:06:58] <deucalion> I think writing a tetrinet client for psi would take things to the next level ;)
[... and no, please don't do that!]
[15:13:12] <deucalion> mmh... seems I mixed up the throttling stuff and ran at 23% of my possible cpu speed... :P
[15:13:20] <iono> < tremendous
[15:13:34] <deucalion> iono: in ruining things?
[15:13:39] <iono> |Kev|
[15:13:39] <deucalion> ;)
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[16:57:23] <psidekick> 24 Jun 11:49 - Some tooltip tweaks. - Some tooltip tweaks. - http://dev.psi-im.org/darcs/web/darcsweb.cgi?r=psi;a=commit;h=20060624114908-04f00-2788234457cef82c1864e0c8151c129d6688b67a.gz
[16:59:22] <psidekick> 24 Jun 12:18 - Some options tweaking. - Some options tweaking. - http://dev.psi-im.org/darcs/web/darcsweb.cgi?r=psi;a=commit;h=20060624121843-04f00-908921bbce485358fe5554859d46612fd2590f68.gz
[17:02:24] <BartVB> I hear an echo :)
[17:02:56] <Norman@Home> an echo?
[17:03:06] <deucalion> ... does psi-darcs-mainline@rss.jabber.ru actually do anything?
[17:03:10] <deucalion> or is it just plain broken?
[17:03:23] <deucalion> I didn't get any messages on the recent changes of psi trunk...
[17:03:37] <Norman@Home> yea, i get them
[17:03:40] <deucalion> mh
[17:03:55] <Norman@Home> when did you sign up?
[17:03:59] <Norman@Home> and di you give it auth?
[17:04:02] <deucalion> a week or two ago
[17:04:03] <deucalion> yes
[17:04:11] deucalion tries removing and adding again
[17:04:58] <Norman@Home> you can always send it a command to send the items to you
[17:05:00] <deucalion> mh
[17:05:06] <Norman@Home> do you igone headline events?
[17:05:12] <deucalion> aaah
[17:05:13] <deucalion> yes
[17:05:18] <deucalion> thank you :D
[17:06:17] <deucalion> thx :)
[17:14:49] <remko> great, now i can finally cut down my Psi interface to the bare necessities
[17:15:02] <ALok@lappy> 4.1.4 is great...
[17:15:11] <ALok@lappy> now instead of using full cpu
[17:15:14] <ALok@lappy> it crashes
[17:15:22] <Norman@Home> rofl
[17:15:24] <remko> no more normal messages, no more change profile, no more admin, no more 'active chats', ...
[17:15:33] <remko> alok: gdb
[17:15:40] <ALok@lappy> at least on one of my machines it does...
[17:15:40] <Maarten> @remko: evil :)
[17:15:53] <remko> evil ?
[17:15:56] <ALok@lappy> on the machine i built it on it works better
[17:16:01] <remko> Maarten: normal client you mean
[17:16:04] <Maarten> evil is a good thing :)
[17:16:05] <ALok@lappy> but i copied it to another machine...
[17:16:10] <ALok@lappy> and it crashes
[17:16:14] <remko> Maarten: i have hardly ever used those things in my life
[17:16:25] <remko> Maarten: and i think most normal users don't have any use for those
[17:17:04] <Maarten> remko: i don't use them too, so it is a good thing you can put them away now :) and to all good things i say 'evil' nowadays
[17:17:14] <remko> Maarten: oh ok :)
[17:17:23] <Maarten> evil, uh? :)
[17:17:32] <remko> Maarten: oh, 'show away/xa' can also be put away
[17:17:36] <remko> i mean, who the hell needs that
[17:19:42] <zenek42> noone
[17:20:01] <remko> that's what i always say, but i keep on getting blamed for saying things like that
[17:20:25] <remko> i have accidentally enabled that option for a few times
[17:20:37] <remko> i can tell you, seeing contacts disappear from your contact list when they go away is weird
[17:20:40] <remko> and very hard to explain
[17:20:55] <remko> even with 'show offline' enabled i couldn't find them anymore
[17:21:07] <Norman@Home> rfol
[17:21:09] <Norman@Home> rofl
[17:21:10] <Norman@Home> ugh
[17:21:12] <Maarten> but why is it an option anyway?
[17:21:14] Norman@Home is now known as Norman
[17:21:24] <Maarten> just because kopete has it or something?
[17:21:28] <remko> Maarten: because if i remove it, i get 10 complaints of angry users
[17:21:46] <remko> Maarten: that's with *every* thing i have ever removed, how silly it may have sounded
[17:22:18] <remko> Maarten: anyway, my new procedure will be the following: version X: introduce option. Version X+1, disable by default. version X+2 remove from UI
[17:22:19] <remko> :)
[17:22:20] <Maarten> those irritating users... maybe you should keep your programs only to yourself so you won't have complaining users ;)
[17:22:29] <zenek42> It means it was a mistake to even add that feature ;-)
[17:22:29] <remko> Maarten: very tempting ;)
[17:22:32] <iono> :)
[17:22:42] <remko> Maarten: althugh i am tempted to disable the 'show away' by default actually
[17:22:45] <remko> it makes no sense at all
[17:23:09] <Norman> huh? I often want to see my away contacts
[17:23:19] <remko> Norman: the question is, how often do you want to hide them
[17:23:24] <Maarten> you ALWAYS want to see your away contacts i think
[17:23:26] <Norman> oh - never
[17:23:30] <zenek42> The answer is niemals :-)
[17:23:33] <remko> exactly :)
[17:23:51] <Norman> sorry I read the logic of " tempted to disable the 'show away' " the other way around :-P
[17:23:58] <remko> Norman: yeah :)
[17:24:46] <Norman> does 0.11 have show status msg? I can't remember
[17:24:51] <remko> nope :(
[17:25:22] <Norman> hrm, where did that come from in build? what it from your wc?
[17:25:25] <remko> yeah
[17:25:29] <Norman> k
[17:25:30] <Maarten> it was a patch from machekku I think for 0.10
[17:25:42] <Maarten> ah, ok
[17:25:43] <remko> Maarten: actually, it was a combined patch of me and skazi
[17:25:45] <Norman> but it was in remko's wc, which is why it's in my bundle
[17:25:54] <remko> Maarten: skazi doing the hard work, me doing the trimming stuff down :)
[17:25:58] <Norman> skazi did the complete rich roster,
[17:26:11] <Norman> which was very cool, but you _had_ the edit the config file to use it
[17:26:38] <Norman> but it allowed different styles by regex,
[17:26:45] <Norman> which is great for the rss feeds
[17:27:44] <psidekick> 24 Jun 13:12 - More UI tweaks. - More UI tweaks. - http://dev.psi-im.org/darcs/web/darcsweb.cgi?r=psi;a=commit;h=20060624131200-04f00-085655fd808a5008cd878c93c853089670fbbdfb.gz
[17:28:25] remko leaves the room
[17:28:45] <Maarten> let's compile that one too..
[17:28:47] Maarten leaves the room
[17:29:24] <Norman> ewwww, whoever updated the darcs web interface, deserves to be shot
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[17:29:31] <Norman> it looks fine in IE, and horrid in Fx
[17:29:47] <Norman> (probably doesn't validate either)
[17:30:16] <remko> it looks fine here, but i have seen it horrible as well somewher
[17:30:21] <remko> let's see if there is an update available
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[17:30:34] <Norman> what browser you looking in?
[17:31:39] <remko> fx
[17:31:57] <Norman> what v?
[17:32:14] <remko> oh no my bad
[17:32:15] <remko> camino
[17:32:39] <ALok> camino firefox mozilla smae difference
[17:32:42] <remko> safari does well as well
[17:33:07] ALok coughs mac
[17:33:22] <remko> indeed on mac
[17:33:59] <Norman> does the Psi logo appear on the far right, or squashed near left?
[17:34:05] <remko> far right
[17:34:13] <remko> but as i said, i have seen the squashed thingy before somewhere
[17:34:13] <Norman> what version?
[17:34:17] <remko> can't remember
[17:34:31] <remko> Norman: camino, but i don't know which version of gecko that is
[17:34:37] <Norman> help about will say
[17:34:38] <psidekick> Norman: Type !commands for a list of commands.
[17:34:50] <Norman> !about
[17:34:51] <remko> Norman: it didn't
[17:34:57] <Norman> oh
[17:35:14] <remko> Version 2006042704 (1.0.1)
[17:35:21] <remko> but that doesn't help you at all
[17:35:25] <remko> because that's camino versioning ;)
[17:35:27] <Norman> nope, I'm using .... Gecko/20060508 Firefox/1.5.0.4
[17:35:44] <Norman> okay, ctrl-f5 fixed it
[17:35:45] <remko> maybe the date is indeed the gecko version
[17:36:01] <Norman> must have been a stale stylesheet
[17:36:26] <remko> yes, i d efinitely dig my new Psi setup. I should create a defaults-lite.xml :)
[17:37:14] <Norman> remko: maybe make a way to pick which defaults you want when you create a new profile
[17:37:29] <Norman> lite,normal,fcking-crazy
[17:37:36] <remko> Norman: there is no such thing as a 'new profile' in my lite version
[17:37:41] <remko> Norman: :)
[17:38:00] <Norman> how does it ask for jid on missing conf then?
[17:38:11] <Norman> or is your login info compiled in?
[17:38:15] <remko> no of course not
[17:38:19] <remko> but that's post-profile
[17:38:23] <remko> that's account dialog
[17:38:32] <Norman> k
[17:39:00] <Norman> I never even see the profile box, default loads by default
[17:39:11] <remko> indeed, but that's only been like that since i think 0.10
[17:39:18] <remko> maybe 0.9.3
[17:39:22] <Norman> and the default profile name is a machine setting which is a pain
[17:39:33] <remko> Norman: what do you mean ?
[17:39:44] <Norman> or it was in 0.9.?
[17:39:55] <Norman> if I create a profile called 'norman', and make it default, load on startup
[17:40:14] <Norman> and my girlfriend creates on (under her user account), with her name,
[17:40:26] <remko> oh you're talking windows
[17:40:31] <remko> i see what you mean
[17:40:35] <Norman> then psi tries to load her's when I login, and visaversa
[17:40:43] <remko> would it help if it got moved under %APPDATA% ?
[17:40:48] <Norman> it does
[17:40:49] <Norman> so we're both using the 'default' profile,
[17:41:04] <remko> so %APPDATA% is user-specific ?
[17:41:05] <Norman> but because they're under %APPDATA%, they're different
[17:41:07] <Norman> yes
[17:41:10] <remko> great
[17:41:13] <remko> it's on our TODO
[17:41:27] <Norman> but however the profile to load on startup is stored, is global, not user psecific
[17:41:48] <remko> it hasn't been done because it involves recursive copying of the .psi dir to the new location etc.
[17:42:16] <Norman> well it works as it is atm, we both have seperate 'default' profiles, which load on startup
[17:42:44] <Norman> so not even urgent
[17:42:52] <remko> ok
[17:43:29] <Norman> everyone has their own profile, and as long as they're all called the same thing they load without prompting
[17:44:40] <Norman> not easy to explain is it :-P
[17:44:49] <ALok> i think it could be
[17:45:02] <Norman> (I just re-read the conversation, and I only understand it, because I know what I meant to said)
[17:45:03] <ALok> are you saying that the "defaut" profile is stored globally?
[17:45:07] <Norman> no,
[17:45:15] <Norman> profiles are stored per-user, correctly
[17:45:21] <ALok> the name of the "default" stored globally
[17:45:31] <Norman> but the setting that says 'please load x on startup', is stored globally,
[17:45:39] <ALok> thats what i mean
[17:45:42] <ALok> yea i get what you meabn
[17:45:46] <Norman> yea,
[17:46:01] <ALok> that makes sense
[17:46:10] <ALok> shouldn't it be the same for *nix ?
[17:46:21] <ALok> or is there a lack of global options in nix?
[17:46:22] <Norman> no, the 'please load x on startup' should be per user too
[17:46:38] <ALok> it should be i know
[17:46:45] <ALok> but what of linux?
[17:46:51] <ALok> what is its current behaviour?
[17:46:57] <Norman> nafc
[17:47:03] <zenek42> On multi-user system there's nooo need for profiles at all, is it?
[17:47:11] <ALok> there could be
[17:47:20] <Norman> one user can have multiple profiles,
[17:47:24] <Norman> if they wanted to
[17:47:29] <Norman> that's allowed
[17:47:39] <ALok> there may not be a huge need...
[17:47:44] <ALok> but it exists
[17:47:54] <remko> Norman: ah, but that is a Qt issue
[17:47:59] <Norman> remko: probably
[17:48:02] <remko> Norman: the 'load x on startup' was stored by Qt
[17:48:15] <ALok> i keep getting bored...
[17:48:17] <remko> is still stored by Qt
[17:48:25] <ALok> i need to find new things to do...
[17:48:35] <ALok> bbl
[17:48:38] <remko> alok: fix bugs in Psi
[17:48:53] <Norman> remko: any idea where? I assumed the registry
[17:49:21] <remko> Norman: it changed recently, i don't keep track
[17:49:31] <Norman> seems to be current_user\software\affinix\psi
[17:49:33] <remko> Norman: but yeah, registry. It should be a lot better now
[17:49:34] <Norman> which is good
[17:49:45] <remko> Norman: i think we changed the string
[17:49:47] <Norman> so maybe it was just an old 0.9.3 bug
[17:49:57] <remko> maybe so
[17:50:13] <Norman> probably,
[17:50:48] <Norman> so what are the chances we would get rich roster in mainline?
[17:50:56] <Norman> would it be part of the roster re-write?
[17:51:01] <Norman> which we might see for 0.11?
[17:51:06] <remko> Norman: yes, the new roster *has* to have 'show status'
[17:51:35] <remko> Norman: but for 0.11, if you can get my old wc patches ported and they working, who knows
[17:51:43] <remko> Norman: the problem was that we lost 2 pixels per contact
[17:51:48] <remko> Norman: which was rather annoying
[17:51:57] <Norman> lost?
[17:51:59] <Norman> btw: have you tried qt4.1.4 yet? I assume it's better than 4.1.3 (not hard), but is it better than 4.1.2?
[17:52:36] <remko> Norman: yeah, 413 already had several improvements, such as newlines working in copy pastes
[17:52:49] <remko> Norman: so 414 should be the best of 413 minus the nasty new bugs
[17:52:54] <Norman> 413 just had the 100% bug
[17:53:43] <ALok> 414 crashes my computer
[17:53:56] <ALok> it seems less stable than 413
[17:54:29] <ALok> but thats hard...
[17:54:42] <ALok> because it crashed more on a computer i did not build it on
[17:54:44] <remko> alok: gdb please
[17:54:51] <ALok> i am on windows!
[17:55:00] <remko> alok: maybe it's not qt's fault
[17:55:04] <Norman> so?
[17:55:11] <Norman> what did you use to build?
[17:55:11] <ALok> maybe its not qt's fault
[17:55:12] <Norman> mingw?
[17:55:19] <ALok> yea its all mingw
[17:55:26] <Norman> so mingw has gdb
[17:55:33] <ALok> i don't know anything about gdb
[17:55:42] <Norman> you don't need to know anything
[17:55:53] <Norman> just run 'gdb psi' and when it crashes type 'bt full'
[17:56:02] <ALok> brb
[17:56:04] <Norman> then copy & paste the gumf into a pastbin
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[17:57:26] <ALok> no gbd
[17:57:29] <ALok> gdb
[17:57:51] <ALok> none at all
[17:58:03] <Norman> remko: erm, "we lost 2 pixels per contact", what was doing that? I don't see it in my 0.10-bundle
[17:58:16] <Norman> ALok: maybe you need mingw-dtk
[17:58:18] <Norman> not sure
[17:58:25] <remko> Norman: compare 2 0.10 versions: one without the patch, and one with
[17:59:32] <ALok> o well no gdb
[17:59:34] <Norman> k, testing 0.10 darcs
[17:59:45] <ALok> espeically sine the machine it crashes more on... is not a build platform
[18:00:12] <ALok> its crashing with the event count toolbar thingy
[18:00:14] <ALok> bbl
[18:00:16] <Norman> does it give you that crash window?
[18:00:18] <Norman> with the debug button maybe?
[18:00:37] <ALok> i can get those dumps maybe
[18:00:45] <ALok> or whatever windows gives
[18:00:54] <ALok> i get the window send report window
[18:00:57] <Norman> yea, the drwatson dump
[18:01:01] <ALok> i'll liik at it a bit later
[18:01:27] <Norman> remko: 0.10 vanilla, 0.10-bundle, 0.11 vanilla, all the same
[18:02:05] <remko> Norman: depends on the font size ;)
[18:02:10] <remko> Norman: in my case, i lost pixels
[18:02:16] <remko> i don't know if i still have proof
[18:03:40] <Norman> hrm, maybe os dependant
[18:03:51] <Norman> almost sounds like different font defaults
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[18:26:46] <remko> Norman: no, it's not font defaults, and it happened on linux anx mac
[18:26:53] <remko> Norman: it seems to be an edge case if the font is just big enough
[18:27:47] <Norman> well, some font size, that makes it happen yea,
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[22:55:50] <zenek42> btw, drag'n'drop in the affiliations editor is supposed to work? When I try it the cursor becomes disabled (the icon with crossed circle, hope you know what I mean)
[23:08:22] <remko> zenek42: it is supposed to work.
[23:08:24] <remko> zenek42: from where to where are you dragging ?
[23:10:54] <zenek42> from banned to members
[23:14:55] <remko> hmm, that is odd
[23:14:59] <remko> it works perfectly here
[23:15:05] <remko> zenek42: linux +
[23:15:07] <remko> linux ?
[23:15:12] <remko> i'll have to try it there
[23:17:12] <zenek42> yep
[23:23:31] <deucalion> mmmh... qt-copy recompile only took 3 hrs after removing the throttling by 82%... :P
[23:24:04] <deucalion> I know this is very off-topic, but... did anyone here try out kde4 yet? (i.e. what exists of it in kde svn)
[23:24:16] <IceRAM> [03:34:06] <Kev> I'd be shocked if they're not autotools
[23:24:22] <IceRAM> reffering to KDE
[23:24:27] <IceRAM> KDE4 moved to CMake
[23:24:34] <deucalion> yes
[23:24:40] <IceRAM> they got it running
[23:24:44] <Kev> thanks :)
[23:24:49] <iono> groogle, ahhar
[23:25:05] <IceRAM> I still find qconf a bit difficult
[23:25:20] <Kev> qconf's pretty smart
[23:25:21] <deucalion> do I have to understand any of the last 8 lines here?
[23:25:23] <Kev> it's just c++
[23:25:26] <Kev> deucalion: nope
[23:25:45] <deucalion> Kev: k :P
[23:25:50] <iono> There's nothing sexier than a never
[23:27:14] <IceRAM> Kev: I understand... but I need to read the docs better.. if there are any
[23:27:26] <Kev> I don't think there are
[23:27:31] <IceRAM> http://delta.affinix.com/qconf/ points to Psi's CVS
[23:28:02] <IceRAM> which.. amaizingly... it works
[23:28:17] <IceRAM> 2 months justin update for 1.2
[23:28:19] <IceRAM> hmm...
[23:29:00] <IceRAM> I assume qconf moved to qt4... but.. the CVS is not the place to find the latest version, right?
[23:30:37] <remko> it is
[23:30:47] <remko> it is moved to qt4, and cvs is the place to look for qconf
[23:32:22] <remko> and you can look at the various Psi and QCA modules as documentation ;-)
[23:33:32] <IceRAM> :)
[23:33:36] <IceRAM> yup
[23:34:29] <IceRAM> so.. for a quick understanding
[23:34:50] <IceRAM> qconf receives psi.qc and generates the ./configure script, right?
[23:36:24] <IceRAM> or.. people edit the configure script by their desire?
[23:36:24] <IceRAM> :D
[23:36:55] <IceRAM> because... that's what I've done... until now... and.. apparently... it is not quite right
[23:38:04] <IceRAM> hmm.. I see "--enable-plugins" in there
[23:38:32] <IceRAM> but... I can't find it in psi.qc for example
[23:38:44] <Kev> look in the directory
[23:38:50] <Kev> there's all the optionals in there
[23:39:10] <IceRAM> oh... qcm
[23:39:31] <IceRAM> never thought that qcm might be configure related.. the name doesn't say a thing
[23:40:23] <remko> IceRAM: qconf module
[23:41:35] <IceRAM> well... now I understand... :)
[23:43:13] IceRAM is rewinding room text
[23:43:26] <IceRAM> (aka scrolling history up)
[23:44:21] <IceRAM> remko, Norman: about last used profile
[23:45:07] <IceRAM> on windows, it is indeed saved in the registry (which is a bit of a pain IMO, given that it there are only 2 options)
[23:45:32] ALok thinks the registry should be destroyed
[23:45:42] <ALok> such a stupid idea
[23:45:53] <IceRAM> on Linux, it is saved in XDG_DATA_HOME
[23:46:01] <ALok> what is that ?
[23:46:02] <IceRAM> which is the right place to be
[23:46:23] <ALok> i like the classic method of just storing everyting in the home dir
[23:46:24] <IceRAM> http://freedesktop.org/wiki/Standards/basedir-spec
[23:46:43] <IceRAM> XDG_DATA_HOME is by default in the home dir
[23:46:48] <ALok> o?
[23:46:56] <ALok> where can it be?
[23:46:57] <IceRAM> BUT, contrary to the classic ~/.appname
[23:48:19] <ALok> ?
[23:48:40] <IceRAM> oh... sorry... replace XDG_DATA_HOME with XDG_CONFIG_HOME
[23:48:49] <ALok> so ...
[23:48:58] <ALok> so if its not ~/.appname ? what is it?
[23:49:18] <IceRAM> $XDG_CONFIG_HOME (env variable) = ~/.config
[23:49:22] <IceRAM> by default
[23:49:41] <ALok> so...
[23:49:55] <IceRAM> so..
[23:49:59] <ALok> every program is supposed to store in ~/.config or whatever that var is?
[23:50:23] <IceRAM> so, using QSettings
[23:50:52] <IceRAM> lastProfile information is saved in
[23:51:12] <IceRAM> ~/.config/psi-im.org/Psi.conf
[23:51:26] <ALok> ah
[23:51:56] <ALok> home dir is nice...
[23:52:05] <IceRAM> yes...
[23:52:20] <ALok> especialliy on a diff partiton
[23:52:22] <IceRAM> but the basedir spec (addopted by Trolltech also in Qt4)
[23:52:31] <IceRAM> is better, IMO
[23:52:34] <ALok> i really wouldn't care...
[23:52:39] <ALok> as long as its in the homedir
[23:52:44] <IceRAM> indeed :)
[23:52:55] <IceRAM> the nice thing is that
[23:52:58] <IceRAM> there are
[23:53:12] <IceRAM> $XDG_CACHE_HOME $XDG_CONFIG_DIRS $XDG_CONFIG_HOME $XDG_DATA_DIRS $XDG_DATA_HOME
[23:53:43] <IceRAM> the *_HOME env variables point by default to locations in the $HOME dir
[23:54:21] <IceRAM> so.. you technically can split cache, data and configuration
[23:54:27] <IceRAM> into different folders
[23:57:14] <IceRAM> + if (PsiOptions::instance()->getOption("options.ui.message.enabled").toBool())
+ pm.insertItem(IconsetFactory::icon("psi/sendMessage"), tr("New &blank message"), 6);
[23:57:33] <IceRAM> I changes like this very very very very much
[23:57:36] <IceRAM> thanks remko

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